Sherpa's Methylation Journal

[Critterina]

@Sherpa ! It's great to hear such good news, and things are happening to you so fast! A sacrifice of a weekend is something most of the people here would gladly make, as a result of having a week as good as yours.

I have to ask: does the ex- in your subtitle refer to BOTH workaholic and adrenaline junkie?

 

[Sherpa]

@Sherpa A sacrifice of a weekend is something most of the people here would gladly make, as a result of having a week as good as yours.

I have to ask: does the ex- in your subtitle refer to BOTH workaholic and adrenaline junkie?

Yeah..I am both an ex-workaholic (internet marketer) and ex-adrenaline junkie (snowboard, mountain bike, trance, Burning man, etc.) All that hard and fast, extreme living took a serious toll on my mitochondrial function. So here I am!

After a restful weekend I am back on track and feeling the positive effects of the supplements again. Extra energy today I got some magnesium oil in the mail today and sprayed 5 pumps on my belly (in addition to the 800mg oral that morning). I could feel its effects, its obvious I'm deficient.

I did note some physical issues in the past 48 hours: muscle fatigue and cramping in my arms after light exertion ( a little raking & sweeping) that would normally have very minimal effect. Today I felt arm cramps and maybe a slightr tremor in my hands at my desk job after no exertion. I felt something was "off," ran to the store for 12oz of coconut water & drank it... and I didn't notice any more complaints after that. Hypokalemia? Or ???

I can tell the mineral balance: sodium, potassium, magnesium is VERY important and I need to dial it in.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Keep an eye on magnesium toxicity

izzy

 

[Critterina]

12 oz of coconut water is what, about 800 mg of K? Yep, probably that was it. OR hypoglycemia. Coconut water has a lot of carbs, too, which would have fixed the low blood sugar (trembling). Maybe both. It's so hard to tell.

I had constant headaches for about 4 months. I noticed that sometimes they abated after a meal. Hypoglycemia? Chewing action? I was hoping the latter, so I researched some non-terrible chewing gum. I tried it. No deal. I guess it was the food.

 

[Sherpa]

@Gondwanaland I have read, somewhere, that you can take oral magnesium until you get loose stools ('to bowel tolerance') and at that point you are taking a 'toxic' amount your system doesn't want. I have not reached that limit, and had taken 800mg for long terms before with no obvious issues.

@Critterina 12oz = 550mg K. I eat a very clean, very balanced Paleo type diet and I haven't felt hypoglycemic for years. I think it's not blood sugar-related.

Today I found out I was rejected from 23andme because my spit is weird and gave too many errors.

Dear Sherpa,

Thank you for purchasing 23andMe's Personal Genome Service. Our laboratory analyzed your second saliva sample, but again was not able yield results which met our quality standards. The laboratory made multiple attempts to analyze your sample but was unable to return a satisfactory call rate.

As this is the second sample failure, we are unable to send you another sample kit. There are no known additional steps that would increase chance of success with a third sample. A full refund, less shipping and handling, is available to you.

Request refund for: Sherpa

Click here to get your refund now:

I must have some CRAZY genetic mutations... maybe something like the rare and diabolical MTHFR X666Y +/+/+ that cursed the lab equip

 

[Coolie]

Less shipping??? The Bar stewards! Have they even sent you anything??? I would say if they don't have the technology to do it, that's their problem, why should you have to pay handling?

 

[Sherpa]

Last night I experienced symptoms of calcium - magnesium imbalance.

Since discovering extra magnesium intake gave me an ATP power up, I got experimental: I stopped oral magnesium and tried it through the skin. I tried a couple Epsom Salt baths. I tried 10 sprays of transdermal magnesium on my skin - the high end of the dose range sugested in Dr. Myhill's new book. I took little or no calcium.

The magnesium spray seemed to work, but I ran out of energy and felt fatigue around 5pm yesterday. I sprayed 3 more pumps of Mg liquid on my arm. I became wired and also tired. Around 10pm I absolutely could not get to sleep. I felt slight muscle tremors in the face. I started researching and found this excellent thread that describes Chvostek's sign & treatment of Cal-mg imbalances. Sure enough my face was twichy and my upper lip was giving a clear Chvostek's sign reaction even without tapping my cheek.

@Kimsie advises

the person should increase their intake of calcium or lower the dose of magnesium until the (Chvostek) sign goes away. The sign appears before any noticeable symptoms of calcium deficiency. If a person also begins to feel fatigued then they should cut back on the magnesium and raise the calcium even more. It is dangerous to keep pushing the magnesium when the calcium levels are low. It is possible to cause heart block if it gets too severe.

Well, darn. Great advice, thanks Phoenix Rising!

Lemme tell you, I was wired. No chance of sleep. I went to the 24-hour gym at 3 am and pumped iron (a first!). I didn't sleep much after.

Today I took calcium tablets and skipped the magnesium.

Now I can see how very serious & important mineral balance is. Calcium, potassium & magnesium have to be in harmony or the symptoms can be severe.

I am going to try:

• 1200mg calcium tablets
• 3 to 5 sprays of magnesium oil
• 550mg Potassium in coconut water
• sodium - iodized sea salt to taste on food

per day.

Is there anything I am missing?

 

[Sherpa]

Feels like I got the calcium magnesium imbalance twitchyness evened out. Now taking a modest amount of transdermal magnesium (5 sprays) and a small amount of oral calcium (500mg).

But I think I'm over methylating - or sensitive to methylation supplements - at 400mcg mfolate and 1000mcg mB12 sublingual.

It feels like the same breed of insomnia I got when I tried SAMe 400mg a few years ago. I felt awesome and kinda euphoric but just couldn't sleep. No matter what. I have been getting a the same flavor of insomnia the past several nights.

I don't like getting wired, sleeping bad and blowing out neurological fuzes.

So today, I cut back to 267mcg methylfolate.

I am going to explore Lipid Replacement Therapy (LRT). I am interested in trying supplements like NT Factor Energy Lipids powder or BodyBio PC - that claim to help rebuild damaged tissues. @Aerose91 said that taking PC can really help some people heal and become less sensitive to methylation supplements.

One thing I know is that I damaged my body from eating low fat, high cab vegan & vegetarian for many years.

I will see how I respond to lipid therapy before making further attempts up the summit of Mt. Methylation

 

[Sherpa]

I am having overmethylation problems.

Clearly, these supplements are working - they have a powerful effect. When I was at 400mcg methylfolate I had plenty of energy, so much that I couldn't take my normal dose of d-ribose. So I went off the d-ribose. I was, miraculously, able to function without it. Only problem, I couldn't get to sleep at night easily. Feeling more confident and capable, I did 2 hours of light outdoor gardening work and --_)_))__(_)^ $#%# CRASH - PEM, muscle ache, depression, FML (f#$@ my life). A couple doses of d-ribose afterwards "rescued" me.

The catch-22: methylation supplements boot energy enough to allow me to marginally function without relying on d-ribose, but if I do anything approaching "normal" activity levels I am still susceptible to crashing. Taking both methylation supplements (400mcg mfolate + 1mg EnzyB12) and also d-ribose, even at reduced doses, causes me to get wired and overstimulated. More serious sleep problems.

I get two semi-conflicting pieces of advice. @caledonia "Start Low and go Slow" document says to STOP & get off methylation supplements. Then restart gently. This document also says to take 1/10th tab of nicotinic acid for temporary relief.

Dr. Lynch's article says to "stay on the methylation supplements and just take niacin as needed"

Decisions, decicions!

1.) I could stop the methylation supplements completely and go back on my tried-and-tolerated Multivitamin drink (with cyanocobalmin + folic acid) for a while... take Lipids (NT Factor Energy Lipids) to repair membranes...

2.) I could lower the dose of methylfolate to 133mcg. Let the methylation cycle crank down but not go off it completely. Then work on Lipid Therapy.

3.) Stay on the current dose (267mcg) of methylfolate and just take niacin as needed to get to sleep.

Leaning towards #2

 

[Sherpa]

The MethylB12 and methylfolate multivitamin was too intense for my sensitive system.

So... I have been slowly starting up Rich's Simplified Mthylation Protocol.

In additional to basics (C,D, fish oil, magnesium) I am taking:

- 1 capsule All-in-One Multivitamin/Multimineral - A.M.
- 1 tab Nature Made B-Complex - P.M.
- 1 capsule Pure Encapsulations Trace Minerals
- 2 lozenges of Swanson Ultra Sublingual Vitamin B-12 - Hydroxycobalmin.
- NT Factor EnergyLipids powder - 2x a day, approx 650mg total.

I have yet to add in folinic acid, methylfolate.

It seems much gentler. My energy is smooth and steady but not huge... just sufficient. My GERD is gone and my sleep is excellent. I don't want to go to the gym at 3 a.m. anymore.

 

[Avalon]

Fantastic, I tried some folinic acid yesterday, it felt nice, not too stimulating, my head is clear. Only one day though, I'll see if that continues.

 

[whodathunkit]

@Sherpa, when I first started all this, d-ribose helped me a great deal. I took it in the morning every day, with extra before and after exercise.

Maybe try taking some d-ribose *before* you do any physical activity, then a little bit after. Maybe that will help prevent crashes. It didn't prevent me from crashing when I really overdid it like with HIIT, but for normal-paced activity it was a godsend. And even with HIIT or big weights it helped (still helps) with muscle soreness. It prevent the formation of too much lactic acid or something. I forget now. But it's good stuff.

I ultimately stopped it because I didn't feel I needed it any more, but also because long-term use can possibly exacerbate blood sugar issues, since it affects the muscles using glucose. I have blood sugar issues. If I didn't, I might still be taking it.

Also, FWIW, I think you're on a good track with the lipid protocol. I always forget about that, but it's also something that has helped me enormously. I still take NT Factors and krill/asthanxin(sp?).

You might want to search out some posts by user @Radio. I dont think he's around any more but he was big on lipids and maintained that many if not most of us needed to address cell integrity with lipid therapy before we could successfully get onto methylation. He may have been right.

Glad things are smoothing out. Just don't get discouraged if you hit a few more bumps as time goes by. It's just the situation evolving, and you can fix those bumps, too.

 

[Sherpa]

@whodathunkit

I spent about 8 months on d-ribose, it helped me in ways similar to how you describe. It was the perfect solution when my methylation cycle was broken down. But once I started tinkering with methylation it suddenly became "too stong" and invoked excitotoxicity and overload. I found that NT Factor + d-ribose in combo is "too strong" for my sensitive system. NT Factor by itself seems to replace my day-to-day biological need for d-ribose supplementation.

After years of supttering and crashing, I now seem to be able to go to the gym and do a moderate, toning workout. I might still be able to use d-ribose to cushion a heavier workout where ATP gets drained hard.

To dig deeper: I have ordered tests for SNPs (23andMe), heavy metal toxicity (hair),and pyroluria

@Radio has some of the very best information out there! Right up there wth Rich VanK and Freddd. It's truly a shame he's not here anymore, but he posts now on: http://forums.prohealth.com/forums/index.php?forums/fibromyalgia-and-me-chronic-fatigue-syndrome.92/ under the name @RadioFM. I highly suggest checking out Radio's posts on ProHealth... tons of new, cutting edge stuff.